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Q&A with Ryan Phelan, Marketing Chief / Fractional CMO at Origin Email

Q&A with Ryan Phelan
Ryan Phelan, Marketing Chief / Fractional CMO at Origin Email has nearly two decades of global online marketing experience focusing on driving GTM strategies for high growth SaaS software and Fortune 250 companies. Ryan is a respected thought leader and nationally distinguished speaker with a history of experience from Adestra, Acxiom, BlueHornet, Sears Holdings, Hewlett-Packard (Global), Skype, First National Bank of Omaha, and U.S. Bank and others. In 2013 he was named one of the top 30 strategists in online marketing and is the Chairman Emeritus of the EEC Advisory Board.  

MEDIA 7: With two decades of global online and email marketing experience, how do you see the online marketing landscape evolving as we tread through uncertain times?

RYAN PHELAN: What powers marketing best is that it's predictable and influenced by data. That has changed.
Here’s what’s coming in the next 12 months: At every level, from B2B to B2C, you have to throw your marketing plans out the window. These uncertain times not only detail the unpredictability of commerce but also highlight consumer unpredictability. Companies must start weekly strategy sessions that rely on following the news, statistics and customer sentiment. Start war rooms – virtual or not – that look at how to speak to different parts of the country.

These war rooms look at each channel to ensure that the message is consistent and ties into the socioeconomic channels in cities and states across the country. We also need to look at new ways of communicating with customers. Communications have to focus on the emotive and empathetic part of marketing instead of "Buy this." This is a challenge because it requires non-traditional, non-predictable thinking. It requires a strategic approach, which most marketers aren't used to taking. I've written often about the need to set down a strategy first and then figure out the tactics later. This need is more present and more fluid today than ever before. What's your strategy for this week? For next week?

That fluidity in the strategy-making process is going to be a challenge for most marketers. You can see this today in the absence of advertising from Fortune 100 companies. Rightly so, many have pulled back on ads to rethink their strategy. Finally, systems like CRMs  are not designed to rapidly react to events or predict what will happen. All that investment we put into our systems to help us plan our marketing will now have to pivot. We will be reworking technology to fit in with a narrative that is not planned far in advance but created weekly. These uncertain times have created chaos and is testing the resolve and creativity of marketers across the spectrum.


"B2B companies should adopt ABM technology to level up their communications and react quickly."

M7: What according to you are some of the most innovative go-to-market strategies that today’s high-growth tech companies should be using?

RP: The most common strategies in B2B revolve around marketing automation, account-based marketing and search engine optimization. Most companies that invested heavily in marketing automation have a lot of programs running but ignore most of them. They send massive amounts of communications, but they aren't in touch. I review their technology to help them recognize intent signals like number of web visitors, time spent on site or on specific pages and what pages they visit. I also audit programs and match them up with qualitative data sets that indicate whether they're sending the right messages at the right times in the right channels.

Then there are companies with a few automation programs. They're focused on just the basics of communications and automation. They need to re-optimize existing programs and invest quickly in new programs that recognize intent. Account-based marketing is a game changer and is true marketing at its best. ABM has two definitions. One is on the sales side, where ABM takes a group of accounts and tries to influence them with personalized, ungated content. On the marketing side, ABM is used to drive traffic, to recognize intent and to reverse-influence users. The marketing side recognizes that people are coming to the property and reverse-engineers content that drives higher intent. Both use ungated content. ABM uses buyer intent that indicates "I'm going to check you out before I want to talk to you." These customers want to learn more before they'll take a phone all or walk through yet another demo.

B2B companies should adopt ABM technology to level up their communications and react quickly. SEO is something B2B marketers should get up to speed on. CEOs hate to spend money on natural search, and that's a mistake. Companies that focus on boosting natural or organic search are finding their investments are paying off, and it complements their paid-search strategy. I advise companies using both paid and natural search to hire an expert to do the work. SEO is not something you can teach yourself and master in six months.

M7: What are some of the common mistakes that modern marketers make in running their digital marketing campaigns? What are the strategies you would recommend to minimize or eliminate those errors?

RP: The biggest mistake is that email marketers favor tactics over strategy. They don't look at why someone reads their emails instead of how they read them or how to send to them. From promotional to triggered emails, from welcome messages to cart abandonment, any kind of email message you can think needs to have a strategy, a "why" behind it. Entrepreneurs who say they don't have time to map out email strategy are missing the boat, and I question their leadership abilities. You don't have to plan out a strategy a year in advance, or even a month. Maybe you plan on Friday for the week ahead. You don't have to map out each point in your strategy either. But you do have to have at least the broad outline.

I'm a big believer in planning a strategy retreat, where you and your team take yourselves out of the day-to-day rat race and plan strategy for the coming year. Even a half-day can work if you can keep the focus strictly on strategic planning – the "why" of what you want to do. Most importantly, you need to get everybody on board with it, first in the conversations and then in the planning and execution. Things are different this year – the strategy you might have planned out so carefully has just blown up – but you can always get the gang back together to come up with new strategies.


"The true sign of an insider is giving back to your industry community without pitching your company or self-aggrandizing. That might mean you join an organization and help others learn and do their jobs better."

M7: From your experience, what are technology companies not doing enough for customer activation?

RP: Recognition of intent. I don't think a lot of SaaS companies are looking for those signals the way they should. What are companies doing to look at pages on-site that indicate high intent? How do you recognize those signals so you can act on them, whether through your marketing automation, sales, email or phone calls?

We aren't thinking about intent on a scale to match the need. A lot of companies go through an exercise where they point-score their prospects. You have to start thinking about what combination of behaviors recognize intent. Consumers, whether in B2B or B2C, give off signals that they're interested. Companies can recognize and react appropriately. Not every action means you should pick up the phone and call them. Recognizing intent signals means you know what you need to do next to move that person down the spectrum so they become a lead or request information or indicate you can call or email them or contact them in some way.

M7: How important is channel integration for the success of a marketing campaign? What are the most essential components of a perfectly orchestrated campaign?

RP: I have never seen a perfectly orchestrated campaign.
What we have instead is coordinated channel distribution. This means I have an idea, and I spread it out evenly across my channels. We see this in big-box communications at Christmas. The retailer will have a theme, and you see that theme in every email, tweet and social media post. That's just a coordinated campaign. A truly orchestrated channel integration means I come up with a strategy and a sub-strategy for each channel that respects the purpose and capability of that channel.

I would ask: How can email support my theme? Then, integrate these actions and insights to other channels. For channel propensity, I've done studies where we looked at consumer cohorts and what the primary method for communications should be. Sometimes it's email. Sometimes it's social. Other times it's direct mail. A truly orchestrated campaign looks at integration of data not just across channels but also customer propensity. That's why I say I haven't seen truly orchestrated campaigns. It takes a lot of work to get to that Nirvana, but you can get there through small steps if you use incremental innovation, which builds on one small improvement at a time. It won't happen overnight, but you can orchestrate over time and gather learnings along the way.


"It takes a lot of work to get to Nirvana, but you can get there through small steps if you use incremental innovation, which builds on one small improvement at a time."

M7: You have a regular article on Marketing Land. Could you tell us about your library of thought leadership blogs, white papers and presentations?

RP: I focus on two audiences with my Marketing Land content. I try to speak in some articles to people from C-level executives on down to the specialists working on the front lines. What I try to do is write on things that matter, things that move the needle for the marketing program. My strategy is to write about things they can put into practice today – a playbook for their marketing programs.
I try to point out what's happening in the world. We're all looking for answers, especially with COVID-19. Nobody knows the right way to move forward. I call on 20 years of experience to suggest things to try, to show where reality and theory get in the way. I try to help save people from the mistakes of the past. I've seen where theory gets in the way of reality. I want to dispel all thoughts of rainbows and unicorns.


M7: What advice would you give to young digital marketers from the point of sharpening their skills as a marketer?

RP: Whenever I start a session with a new client, I show a slide listing authors that marketers should read consistently. A lot of people write about digital or email marketing, but I think there are about 40 who have a valid voice in our industry, and those 40 are on my list. So, the first thing I suggest is to read and soak up all the knowledge that's out there. The second is to ask questions. It's infuriating to run into marketers who think they know everything. There's no room for cockiness in this career. I have been in email marketing for 20 years, and I learn all the time. I ask the stupid questions. We are always learning.

Next, find a mentor. This is the person you go to with stupid questions and to get career advice. I'm not talking about getting free consulting but talking with someone who can point you toward the best way to go with your career.

Finally, give back. The true sign of an insider is giving back to your industry community without pitching your company or self-aggrandizing. That might mean you join an organization and help others learn and do their jobs better. Write articles. Lead webinar. Answer questions on community forums. Speak at conferences.

The true insiders bend over backwards to help others without directly benefiting themselves.


M7: You love cooking during your free time. What are the cuisines you have tried and would want to try using your culinary skills?

RP: I have a collection of about 400 recipes. I enjoy all kinds of cooking. I love Italian food. My mother-in-law is Italian and taught me well. I'm known for steaks and have gotten into sous-vide – a method of cooking in which you put food in a vacuum-sealed bag and cook it in a temperature-controlled water bath. I thoroughly enjoy it. It lets me be creative and experimental, and I've got enough equipment to have a product showcase on QVC.

If you want to see my creations, find me on Instagram.
Give me a recipe, and I can riff. But I'd love to learn how to make food on the fly. I'd love to be as good as the guys on Chopped, where you walk into a kitchen and you're told, "Here, you get this and this and this. Now make something."

ABOUT ORIGIN EMAIL

Origin Email Agency is a group of diverse and experienced digital marketers who know that marketing can be tough in the execution but when you step back, truly step back, you can create greatness. 

Most professionals are focused on the tactics when that's generally what we all are good at.  What companies worldwide need is effective strategies to define the "why" first and the "how" second. 

That's where we come in.  Creating mind-blowing, technology agnostic strategies for some of the largest and smallest companies across the globe.

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Examples of recent, verified customer reviews of DemandScience on the G2 platform: “The level of knowledge and attention the team provides is exceptional.” “They are very flexible, quick to respond and are thorough from beginning to end. I enjoy having a full program that provides the level of insight and lessons learned once the program wraps up. I’d recommend…” “DemandScience - A win for Lead Gen.” “DemandScience is the best way to get highly qualified MQA (Marketing Qualified Accounts) using content syndication campaigns…” “Klarity by DemandScience is the wind beneath my wings.” “Klarity has been an invaluable and versatile tool for our Growth Marketing team. We have been able to use it in a variety of ways including database building, pulling in specific segments to run campaigns to, and identifying target audiences for us to run in both content syndication and display with DemandScience.” DemandScience’s Content Syndication, ABM Display and B2B Intent Data products won 25 awards: Award Report Easiest To Do Business With Relationship Index for Enterprise Account-Based Web and Content Experiences Easiest To Do Business With Relationship Index for Enterprise Account-Based Advertising Easiest To Do Business With Relationship Index for Mid-Market Buyer Intent Data Providers Fastest Implementation Implementation Index for Mid-Market Account-Based Advertising Momentum Leader Momentum Grid Report for Account-Based Web and Content Experiences Momentum Leader Momentum Grid Report for Account-Based Advertising Momentum Leader Momentum Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers Momentum Leader Momentum Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Enterprise Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Small-Business Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Americas Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader EMEA Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Europe Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader United Kingdom Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Enterprise Americas Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture Leader Small-Business Americas Regional Grid Report for Lead Capture High Performer Grid Report for Account-Based Advertising High Performer Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers High Performer Enterprise Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers High Performer Mid-Market Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers High Performer Americas Regional Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers High Performer Americas Regional Grid Report for Marketing Account Intelligence High Performer Europe Regional Grid Report for Account-Based Advertising High Performer Mid-Market Americas Regional Grid Report for Buyer Intent Data Providers Klarity by DemandScience, the company’s B2B marketing and sales Account Intelligence tool for building, sharing, and prioritizing contact lists has won 25 awards: Award Report Fastest Implementation Implementation Index for Small-Business Lead Intelligence Fastest Implementation Implementation Index for Marketing Account Intelligence Fastest Implementation Implementation Index for Sales Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Grid Report for Marketing Account Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Americas Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer Americas Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer EMEA Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer EMEA Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Europe Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer Europe Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer United Kingdom Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer United Kingdom Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Asia Regional Grid Report for Marketing Account Intelligence High Performer India Regional Grid Report for Marketing Account Intelligence High Performer Asia Pacific Regional Grid Report for Marketing Account Intelligence High Performer Mid-Market EMEA Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Mid-Market Americas Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Americas Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Americas Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Small-Business EMEA Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer Small-Business EMEA Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Europe Regional Grid Report for Lead Intelligence High Performer Small-Business Europe Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence High Performer Small-Business United Kingdom Regional Grid Report for Sales Intelligence “Rankings on G2 reports are based on data provided to us by real software buyers,” explained Sara Rossio, Chief Product Officer at G2. “Potential buyers know they can trust these insights when researching and selecting software because they’re rooted in vetted, verified, and authentic reviews.” G2 is one of the world’s largest and most trusted software marketplaces. For more information on G2 Research Scoring Methodologies, visit here. Learn more about what real users have to say at G2’s DemandScience page and Klarity by DemandScience page. About DemandScience DemandScience is the premier B2B demand generation company accelerating global growth for our clients. The DemandScience intelligence platform empowers B2B organizations to swiftly identify the right accounts and target in-market buyers with precision. By combining groundbreaking technologies, machine learning and data science innovation, the company ensures timely delivery of accurate data, intelligence, and insights, adding value to the end-to-end journey from initial engagement to conversion. Founded in 2012, DemandScience provides 1,500 global customers with superior marketing solutions, B2B data, and leads. With a team of 600+ employees across operations in seven countries, DemandScience is certified as a Great Place To Work, named #5 on Fortune Magazine’s 2022 list of the Best Workplaces in Advertising & Marketing, and one of only 143 companies in history to be named to the Inc. 5000 for 10 consecutive years. For further insights on why DemandScience stands at the forefront of transformative demand generation, visit demandscience.com and connect on LinkedIn, X, Facebook, and Instagram. About G2 G2 is the world's largest and most trusted software marketplace. More than 60 million people annually — including employees at all of the FORTUNE 500 — use G2 to make smarter software decisions based on authentic peer reviews. Thousands of software and services companies of all sizes partner with G2 to build their reputation, manage their software spend, and grow their business – including Salesforce, HubSpot, Zoom, and Adobe. To learn more about where you go for software, visit www.g2.com.

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NextRoll Named a Market Testing Grantee for Google’s Privacy Sandbox Initiative

GlobeNewswire | January 09, 2024

NextRoll, the San Francisco-based marketing technology company delivering products for ambitious marketers to grow their businesses, today announced its status as a market testing grantee for Google’s Privacy Sandbox initiative. This initiative represents a groundbreaking shift in online advertising, replacing traditional third-party cookies with innovative solutions prioritizing privacy among Google Chrome users. As a trusted tester and collaborator, NextRoll will play a crucial role in shaping the future of secure and personalized online experiences. NextRoll’s participation in the Google Privacy Sandbox initiative signifies an expansion from its previous role within the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), where it was deeply involved in providing commentary on and proposing solutions for Google’s privacy-first enhancements, a portion of which were ultimately incorporated into the final Protected Audience API. NextRoll is now poised to take an even more hands-on approach by actively testing Google’s newly introduced application programming interfaces (APIs), including verifying the effectiveness of the Protected Audience, Topics, and Attribution Reporting APIs in the first half of 2024. NextRoll is proud to be named a Privacy Sandbox Market Testing Grantee receiving grant funding for engineering and testing-related work to meaningfully contribute testing metrics that are material to the Competition Markets Authority (CMA) review. “NextRoll has always been committed to doing right by our customers and all web users. Our dedication to privacy has been unwavering, even in the era of third-party cookies,” said Andrew Pascoe, vice president of data science engineering at NextRoll. “Now, as the industry evolves, we are thrilled to advocate for solutions that guarantee privacy across all market participants and reinforce our organization’s dedication to fostering a secure online environment.” NextRoll is a leader in adapting to the transforming industry and privacy standards, and acts as a trusted partner and advisor in helping customers navigate digital marketing in a privacy-first space. With Google Chrome moving in the same direction, NextRoll customers gain an early advantage in high-performing advertising through a new approach compared to competitors. About NextRoll NextRoll is a marketing technology company delivering products ambitious marketers use and rely on to grow their businesses. Powered by machine learning and integrated data platforms, NextRoll's technology serves tens of thousands of businesses globally through its two business units: RollWorks, an account-based platform for business-to-business marketing and sales teams, and AdRoll, a marketing and advertising platform for direct-to-consumer brands. NextRoll is a privately-held, remote-friendly company headquartered in San Francisco with additional offices in New York City, Dublin, and Sydney. To learn more, visit www.nextroll.com.

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Buyer Intent Data

ON24 Recognizes 2023’s Leaders in Digital Engagement

Business Wire | January 24, 2024

A recent Forrester survey found that more than 60% of B2B buyers base their final purchase decision solely on the digital content and experiences companies provide. That’s why thousands of B2B companies choose ON24 (NYSE: ONTF), a leading digital engagement platform for B2B sales and marketing that helps enterprises generate data-driven insights and deliver cost-effective revenue growth. Today, ON24, announced the industry-leading digital experiences of 2023 that drove ROI for their organizations. “At ON24, our goal is to propel business success through digital engagement, with our customers at the core. We take pride in helping our customers drive deeper engagement with their target audiences and extract meaningful insights that result in revenue growth,” said Callan Young, CMO, ON24. “It is our honor to recognize the leading organizations that exemplify excellence in leveraging our platform to create digital experiences that not only meet but surpass their audience’s expectations.” The following organizations were recognized for delivering outstanding digital experiences on the ON24 platform in 2023: Danfossdrove product growth and customer retention by leveraging distributor, reseller and customer data to optimize its webinar and digital engagement program. FloQastinfluenced 82% of event pipeline in Q3 and created 120+ new active opportunities by routing high-quality leads from in-experience demo requests directly to sales. Global X ETFsincreased qualified, high-value leads in Australia by 22%, by integrating ON24 engagement data with their CRM and using the platform’s personalization capabilities. Informaticascaled a live event into a hybrid experience across three key regions simultaneously, driving registration and delivering a consistent customer experience on a global scale. Infopro Digitalincreased conversion rates and registrations by automating processes on the ON24 platform and making real-time adjustments based on customer feedback. Kasperskydrove product adoption and business growth by creating new relationships with prospects and fostering existing relationships with customers. KnowBe4generated over $300k in pipeline through an ON24-powered digital experience. The National Association of Student Financial Aid Administrators (NASFAA)achieved 100% participant satisfaction for its unique and impactful digital experience powered by the ON24 platform. PowerSchoolachieved record-breaking registration rates, 75 CTA clicks, over 400 poll responses and 300+ content downloads during an educational experience with ON24. S&P Globaldoubled marketing qualified leads and boosted engagement by designing an ON24 digital experience personalized to different customer segments. Tata Consultancy Servicesdrove revenue growth with record-high registrations for their webinar on ON24, resulting in 70% attendee participation across 30 countries. Texthelpsourced leads during a webinar series and converted at least 70% of them into marketing-qualified leads within 30 days. TOPdeskincreased revenue and improved its customer engagement by 7% YoY and extended the shelf life of its content with an on-demand hub. TravelMediaGroupclosed three deals from a single digital experience by creating a seamless and engaging customer experience on ON24. UCBachieved a 50%+ attendee conversion rate by enhancing the HCP’s experience and integrating ON24 engagement data with its business intelligence system. UnitedHealthcareachieved an 80% cost savings, increased attendee score and engagement with a new digital engagement strategy and an always-on content hub. Wood PLCsourced leads, increased audience engagement and automated continuing professional education credits on ON24, across different time zones. ZoomInfosurpassed webinar benchmarks by generating a record number of marketing-qualified leads and 190 scheduled demos, resulting in 10 closed-won deals. To learn more about 2023’s leaders in digital engagement, watch the on-demand webinar here. About ON24 ON24 is on a mission to re-imagine how companies engage, understand and build relationships with their audience in a digital world. Through our leading sales and marketing platform for digital engagement integrated with generative AI, businesses use our portfolio of webinar, virtual event and content experiences to drive engagement and generate first-party data, delivering ​revenue growth across the enterprise – from demand generation to customer success to partner enablement. ON24 powers digital engagement for industry-leading customers worldwide, including 3 of the 5 largest global technology companies, 3 of the 6 largest US banks, 3 of the 5 largest global healthcare companies, and 3 of the 5 largest global industrial manufacturers, enabling organizations to reach millions of professionals a month for billions of engagement minutes per year with all the first-party data being captured, generated and integrated from one place. ON24 is headquartered in San Francisco with global offices in North America, EMEA, and APAC. For more information, visit www.ON24.com.

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